Battle starts for €50m Air Corps helicopter deal

[Frank]

Battle starts for €50m Air Corps helicopter deal

A TIGHTLY-fought battle began yesterday to select the first armed helicopters to fly with the Irish Air Corps in a deal worth more than €50m.

But with the debacle over the previous attempt to buy medium-lift helicopters worth €100m still fresh in everyone's minds, the Department of Defence is treading cautiously with this tender for up to eight helicopters.

America's Sikorsky, part of the giant United Technologies group, won the last contract. However, amid threats of legal action by losing competitors, the contract for up to five helicopters was cancelled by Defence Minister Michael Smith, ostensibly as part of cutbacks.

The US company - still reeling from the cancellation of its $39bn Commanche scout helicopter programme by the US military which it had developed with Boeing - is again in the frame this time around. It is offering its famous Blackhawk assault transport helicopter and its S-76 model.

Other familiar faces include British-Italian firm Agusta-Westland. It will submit its A-109 helicopter and its new larger AB-139 chopper for the new contract.

Eurocopter is likely to propose its EC-135 and EC-145 or its Cougar helicopter.

At stake is an initial order for six helicopters, two light machines mainly for training and four utility helicopters, with an option on two more.

The utility helicopters will each be able to carry eight heavily-armed soldiers from the Army Ranger Wing. The aircraft will each be armed with two GPMG machine-guns and a range of other weapons, and will be available for a variety of other tasks.

The acquisition marks a sea change in the thinking of the Irish Defence Forces which, heavily committed to aiding the Gardai against terrorists in the last thirty years of the Troubles, largely ignored air mobile concepts using helicopters pioneered in the Vietnam War and adopted by virtually every other army since then.

Now, with the demise of its search and rescue role which has been privatised, the Air Corps will have a clearer task of supporting the Army by moving troops and equipment in small numbers.

Don Lavery

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For those of you with a Unison / irish Independent logon the story can be read here

[alpha foxtrot 07]

lets hope the blackhawk wins

[pilatus]

i think the government said before they would look back into the medium lift helicopters.if agustawestland won this competition with their ab139 that means for commonality the merlin could be seriously reconsidered as it is arguably the best medium lift heli to ever fly with almost better performance characteristics in all arenas when compared to the s92 which is why it is kicking the s92s ass at the minute on the heli market!

Hmmm. No mention of the Bell 412. I wonder are Augusta Bell worried that it might upstage the AB139 with its superior payload and lower price and have deliberately left it out. Also, I wonder how the 145 will fare on the cargo sling front. It may be able to lift 1500 Kgs, but how much fuel can it take with max weight on the sling? The 139 also looks fierce small when you see the paramilitary layout with four troop seats facing out from the center. I doubt you would fit a ninth troop on board, which means you can't carry a section in one go. Strange that there has been no mention of any Russian types too.... all will be revealed shortly no doubt! Blackhawks all the way, screw the light trainers, farm out the training to the Canucks.

[sealion]

The Bell 412 is not a military helicopter. The UH1-Y is however..
There is only a requirement to carry 8 troops plus two crew. The Army section is set to change in the near future,as modern tactics and practices are introduced.

Its worth Noting that mr lavery has used IMO as his source in the past. Not saying he has done the same this time,but there will shortly be more details available that he has made no mention of(which others in the media already have knowledge of),and nothing he mentions in this article has not been mentioned there.
Also Agusta Westland do not make the A109 or the AB139...last time i checked they were still two seperate companies,who collaborated on certain projects. The AB139 was an Agusta Bell collaboration(which is not yet in full production as a military type and is therefor not eligible).

[Pink Panther]

Pilatis,
Could you tell me how many101's were lost or seriously damaged during flight trails.Even though it's on the market for sale the 101(Merlin) still has to prove itself.Out of 16(cormorants) bought by the Canadians, they are lucky if they have 7 serviceable at any one time.The brochure said for every one hour it flies it needs ten hours of maintainence.In fact its taking sixteen hours maintainence for every one hour it flies.The uk's turnout of serviceable 101 aircraft is worse,at one stage it was two out of twenty flying ,that was before an RAF merlin lost a tail rotor in flight,luckily it happened while hovering close to the ground.The entire fleet was grounded for over a month after that.Maybe this is the reason the Canadians have dedcided to buy twenty eight 92's to replace their ageing seaking fleet.The 139 & 101 are two completely different animals.the only thing they have in common is the name westland.

The UH1Y is not for sale to foreign nations as of yet, just as you cannot buy an MH60R from the yanks. They keep all the good stuff to themselves! Augusta seem to just jump into bed with anyone at the moment, as the Deepwater USCG project shows, the list of collaborators on the AB139 side is extensive and includes Bell, Boeing, Raytheon etc, all US companies.

[sealion]

Quote (scorpy @ 08 Aug. 2004,14:40)

The UH1Y is not for sale to foreign nations as of yet, just as you cannot buy an MH60R from the yanks. They keep all the good stuff to themselves!

Their Brochure says otherwise,though they do give a delivery date of 2006, Concurrent with the USMC Project.

[futurepilot]

Foreign countries do not but the UH-60, they buy the s-70 which is the export name of the Blackhawk

[Guinness]

What about the RAAF, JASDF and the ROKAF?

They use the UH-60 Backhawk models!

Guinness

[futurepilot]

Raaf Blackhawks are designated A25 S-70 which are S-70B`s.
The Japanese models which are UH-60j`s were built under licence in Japan and therefore arn`t classed as exports, Had they been built in the US they would be a S-70 varient.
The Rokaf and army use both UH-60p`s and s-70s.The s-70s are American built while the UH-60`s are licence built in Korea and again don`t come under the export name of s-70.
If the Air Corps gets the Blackhawk it will be sold by Sikorsky as the s-70.

[Silver]

And don't forget that the RAAF Blackhawks developed cracks in their pylons.

[FMolloy]

Quote

And don't forget that the RAAF Blackhawks developed cracks in their pylons.

The Aussie Blackhawks were locally-built under license.