Six One

[yossarian]

Ok just heard the news on six one. So what type of Heli do you think they'll get?

A very sad day to loose SAR but at least new Heli's are on the way for definate so long as the current government don't f*** up a second procurement tender process.

[Imshi-Yallah]

The LUH cotract is planned as a replacement for the AIII and Dauphin (which is being retired because its due an expensive upgrade, there are plenty of hours left on it).
The reasoning being that the Dauphin was used for roles that will now be tasked to actual MLHs which we may well see just a few months after the official freezing over of hell.

[Silver]

I'm inclined to think that they will get EC-135's.

I believe the Air Corps favourite is the A109M.

[Taj]

The top brass have let us down in their management of the SAR debacle and their lack of fore sight with the Dauphins too is baffling-everyone on this board realises that in the short to medium term the air corps will never get massive funding, so the powers that be should be looking at maximising the potential of what aircraft are there-we could have a useful section lift capibility for the cost of the simplifying of the Dauphins with lighter systems-total 6/7 million.
No one is talking about using them for night time SAR in bad weather conditions.There is a lot of political cowardice going around.

[sledger]

But how many will they purchase? '>

[FLYER115]

Would secondhand Pumas be worth considering. There are 10 available with 2 available for delivery within 8 weeks.These are fully overhauled low timed ex South African Air force Pumas.
The company also has a large spares backup.

They also have 2 civilian Pumas for sale possible Vip transports?

Check it out at this link (Click on Aircraft)

http://www.helilift.com/default.htm

Puma Specifications.

Powerplant: Two Turbomeca Turbo 111C4 turboshafts of 1,435shp

Max Speed: 163mph (263km/h)

Accommodation: Up to 20 passengers/troops or 7,055lb underslung.

[Silver]

8

[clan]

On the basis that something very heavy hit Smithy on the back of the head and the Army,NS and Air Corp set down to have a chat. The purchase of a cheap second Gazelle for training, keep the Dauphins up grade two of them to be transferred to the Naval wing with Navy pilots two to be lightened and used for Ranger troop transport. 4 A111 to be also used in conjunction with the Army 4 for other Duties including two to be kept with winches. And 8 New medium lift jobs. Or very low hours second hand models.
If they the Air Corp, get new helis, they will have to last a long long time so there is no point retiring aircraft that can go on in different roles for a good number of years yet. Keep them make use of them in different roles and give the Pilots and technicians some varity to fly and work on. Plus paint some of them green.

I'm not so worried about what as how many and when? With the pilots in Sligo returning to the Don and the retirement of the Dauphins still scheduled for August next year, the poor old Alouette is gonna get rather in demand by some fairly senior pilots. I pity the young fellas just qualified on both the Alouette and Dauphin... they may find themselves bumped to the bottom of the pile (along with some not so senior ones!). The 109 is not talked about that much. I still reckon the EC145 is the favourite, but it will take at least 2 years. Maybe 135s in the interim.

[FLYER115]

I would agree with the idea of using the Dauphins in another role with less sophisticated equipment they would the be able to lift more and be much more versatile. I doubt whether it would be a good idea to operate four different helicopter types. After all is this not one of the biggest problems the Air Corps has too many different aircraft and not enough of them?
The AIIIs or the Gazelle should be disposed of.
If parts supply for the AIIIs can be guaranteed for say the next 5 years then why not retain a couple for training.

For a reasonable expenditure probably what will be spent on the Light Utility helicopters (Which will have limited uses).
The Air Corps could have a heli squadron equipped with 4 Dauphins for naval and army support along with 10 SA 330 Pumas as troop transports. Allowing them to lift over 200 troops in one go.
Thus allowing the Army to train in the tactical use of helicopters like every other first world army.

The real danger is that a token force of Light Utility helicopters will be bought and all the Air cops will end up doing is VIP air taxi.

The powers that be have to decide what is wanted from the Air Corps. A military force capable of supporting the Army or a VIP transport operation that any banana republic would be proud of. Imagine the amount of use the politicians would get out of a nice shiny fleet of light Helicopters in say the squirrel or EC 135 class. I can`t see them wanting to get into a muddy Puma equipped for Tactical troop transport I doubt it would be comfortable enough.

Just heard the rumour tha the Belgian Army wants to sell a few of it's A109's.

Does anybody knows if the AC is one of the buyers?

Guinness

[Taj]

The Irish Independent said today that the Air Corps want 8 but sources indicate that 5 is more likely.That would be nothing short of a disaster.

[Taj]

Great news but is 8 enough??They will be replacing 7/8 Allouettes and four(five in reality) Dauphins-a total of 13 aircraft.
It will more than likely be a twin engined type,which rules it out as a training heli, so will the Gazelle have to soldier on?
There is merit to purchasing another second hand Gazelle as an attrition/interim example until something more modern can be purchased(EC120).
Also is the Dauphin retirement definite?Im sure there are plenty of hours left in the airframes-why not modify/simplify them for different roles?

 '>  '>

[FLYER115]

It looks like VIP Air Taxi it will be then. I suppose we will have to wait and see.
But it is looking like another chance will be missed to turn the Air Corps into a properly equipped military organization.
 
At least our VIPs will travel in style just imagine how many more off licences etc they will be able to open now.

[n-e-foo]

The thinking will be (at least by the minister for finance) that because the Air Corps no longer have an SAR role, they wont need as many helicopters.

I honestly cant see an order for more than 4 + 4 on option going through within 5 years, unless the government are truley commited to the defence forces. Remember the Allouettes were bought gradually over a long period.

I was thinking the same re: what would this mean for training and the secondhand gazelle interim solution sounds like an idea - especially since there seems to be quite a few nocking about. Or will they use an A3 or two?!